Notes
Matches 101 to 150 of 11,582
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| 101 | * 1646 i | Abo, Johannes Nicolaus (I8364)
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| 102 | ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ----------- EARLDOM OF CHESTER (VI, 3) Hugh, styled "OF KEVELIOC," EARL OF CHESTER, also VICOMTE D'AVRANCHES, &c., in Normandy, son and heir born at Kevelioc [?Machynlleth], co. Merioneth. He joined in the rebellion against King Henry II, set on foot by Henry, the son of that King, and was taken prisoner at Alnwick, 13 July 1174. He was deprived of his Earldom, and was again in rebellion both in England and Normandy, but, in January 1177, was restored. He married, in 1169, Bertrade, then aged 14 (the King giving her away in marriage "because she was his own cousin "), daughter of Simon de Montfort, Count D'EVREUX by his 1st wife, Maud. He died at Leek, co. Stafford, 30 June 1181, aged about 34 and was buried at St. Werburg's, Chester. His widow died 1227, aged about 7I. [Complete Peerage III:167, XIV:170, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ----------- This nobleman, Hugh (Keveliok), 3rd Earl of Chester, joined in the rebellion of the Earl of Lancaster and the King of Scots against King Henry II, and in support of that monarch's son, Prince Henry's pretensions to the crown. In which proceeding he was taken prisoner with the Earl of Leicester at Alnwick, but obtained his freedom soon afterwards upon the king's reconciliation with the young prince. Again, however, hoisting the standard of revolt both in England and Normandy, with as little success, he was again seized and then detained a prisoner for some years. He eventually, however, obtained his liberty and restoration of his lands when public tranquility became completely reestablished some time about the 23rd year of the king's reign. His lordship m. Bertred, dau. of Simon, Earl of Evereux, in Normandy, and had issue, I. Ranulph, his successor; I. Maud, m. to David, Earl of Huntingdon, brother of William, King of Scotland, and had one son and four daus., viz., 1. John, surnamed le Scot, who s. to the Earldom of Chester, d. s. p. 7 June, 1237; 1. Margaret, m. to Alan de Galloway, and had a dau., Devorguilla, m. to John de Baliol, and was mother of John de Baliol, declared King of Scotland in the reign of Edward I; 2. Isabel, m. to Robert de Brus, and was mother of Robert de Brus, who contended for the crown of Scotland, temp. Edward I; 3. Maud, d. unm.; Ada, m. to Henry de Hastings, one of the competitors for the Scottish crown, temp. Edward I; II. Mabill, m. to William de Albini, Earl of Arundel; III. Agnes, m. to William de Ferrers, Earl of Derby; IV. Hawise, m. to Robert, son of Sayer de Quincy, Earl of Winchester. The earl had another dau., whose legitimacy is questionable, namely, Amicia,* m. to Ralph de Mesnilwarin, justice of Chester, "a person," says Dugdale, "of very ancient family," from which union the Mainwarings, of Over Peover, in the co. Chester, derive. Dugdale considers Amicia to be a dau. of the earl by a former wife. But Sir Peter Leicester, in his Antiquities of Chester, totally denies her legitimacy. "I cannot but mislike," says he, "the boldness and ignorance of that herald who gave to Mainwaring (late of Peover), the elder, the quartering of the Earl of Chester's arms; for if he ought of right to quarter that coat, then must he be descended from a co-heir to the Earl of Chester; but he was not; for the co-heirs of Earl Hugh married four of the greatest peers in the kingdom." The earl d. at Leeke, in Staffordshire, in 1181, and was s. by his only son, Ranulph, surnamed Blundevil (or rather Blandevil) from the place of his birth, the town of Album Monasterium, modern Oswestry, in Powys), as 4th Earl of Chester. * Upon the question of this lady's legitimacy there was a long paper war between Sir Peter Leicester and Sir Thomas Mainwaring---and eventually the matter was referred to the judges, of whose decision Wood says, "at an assize held at Chester, 1675, the controversy was decided by the justices itinerant, who, as I have heard, adjudged the right of the matter to Mainwaring." [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, pp. 365-6, Meschines, Earls of Chester] | Of Chester, Earl Of Chester Hugh Of Kevelioc (I55405)
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| 103 | ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ---------------- copied from soc.genealogy.medieval newsgroup: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ---------------- In a message dated 10/7/98 11:43:15 AM, allenk@pacbell.net writes: < If this is _not_ the case, I surely want to know. I do not have a copy at my office, but my notes say the marriages of Aelfgar are found in Faris, TPA, 140:8i, 191:9, 270:9ii, 210:8. Also Weis, MCS, 4th ed., 12-11. Ist wife Elgiva, d/o Ethelred the Unready, issue: Agatha m 1) Harald 2) Griffith ap Llewelyn, Morkere, Bouchard, Eadwine. Wife 2: Alvarissa Malet, d/o William Malet and Elise Crispin. Issue: Lucy, m Ivo Talyboys. Kenneth Harper Finton Editor/ Publisher THE PLANTAGENET CONNECTION ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ---------------- also from soc.genealogy.medieval newsgroup: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ---------------- In a message dated 9/30/98 12:38:45 PM, taf2@po.cwru.edu writes: << This little article by Katherine Keats-Rohan summarizes and builds upon a century's worth of progress on the issue. While the "antecessores" clause is subject to some interpretation, this theory is preferable to the spurious and problematic Crowland charter. >> I have received some wonderful information, both online and offline on this subject. I see that everyone is tending to accept that Lucy is not Godiva's granddaughter and I appreciate the reasoning behind it. Yet, two things puzzle me greatly and pull me away from this modern interpretation. One is the naming patterns in the following generations. (1) 1 Leofric III --Lord Coventry, Earl Mercia, Leicester 1 b. 0975, of Mercia, England d. 31 Aug 1057, Bromley, Staffordshire, England & Godiva --Lady of Lincoln 2 b. abt 0980, of Mercia, England d. 10 Sep 1067 m. bef 1030 (2) 1a Alfgar III --Earl Mercia* 3 d. 1062 & Alvarissa Malet (3) 1a Lucy Talboys* 4 & Ivo Talboys --Earl of Anjou 5 (4) 1 William de Tailbois b. of Lancaster, England & Margaret Tailbois (5) 1 Goditha Tailbois/Lancaster & Gilbert de Lancaster --4th Baron Kendal Notice that Lucy's granddaughter is named Goditha. Why, if Lucy is not Godiva's granddaughter, would her grandchild be named after Godiva? It is such a common naming pattern. If Lucy's parents were Turold the Sheriff and a daughter of William Malet, as suggested by Katherine Keats-Rohan, there would be no relationship at all with Godiva and no reason for the name to appear in the person of Lucy's granddaughter. I realize that the name is not spelled the same, but certainly it is the same name. Neither Lucy's birth date nor death date are known. Leofric d in 1057 at age 85. Godiva died ten years later at age 87. Their son Aelfgar died in 1062, five years before her mother. If Lucy was 15 when she had her first child, she would have been born around 1047. She would have been only 19 at the time of the Conquest. There are no chronological problems. _The Complete Peerage_ says: "The link between Lucy and Aelfgar is the manor of Spalding, County Lincoln, which was held by Aelfgar before the Conquest and by Lucy's first husband, Ives Taillebois (in her right), at the time of Domesday. No close family connection between Aelfgar and Lucy is mentioned in any contemporary document, and chronology is opposed to the relationship of father and daughter. Moreover, the only known children of Aelfgar are Edwin, Morcar and Aeldgitha, wife of Harold, and consequently the passing of the manor of Spalding cannot be held to justify the inference that Aelfgar (a) was father of Lucy." The second thing that bothers me is the land transfers. It is the basis of the Keats-Rohan argument. But if Lucy's father was Aelfgar III who married Alvarissa Malet daughter of William Mallet and William married the daughter of Thorold the Sheriff, then the naming patterns are consistent and the land transactions make sense. Complete Peerage: "Other manors of Thorold which passed to Lucy are Belchford, Scamblesby, Stenigot, Tetney and Donington. (a) Lucy also held Alkborough, (b) which had belonged in the time of the Confessor to William Malet, (c) father of Lucy's uncle Robert Malet. If Lucy's mother was William Malet's daughter, this may have been her maritagium; and the fact that Thorold gave tithes in this place (d) has been advanced as evidence that he was her husband." Though I accept that the evidence is unclear, I can find no more weight to one argument than the other. - Ken Kenneth Harper Finton Editor/ Publisher THE PLANTAGENET CONNECTION ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ---------------- also from soc.genealogy.medieval newsgroup: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- ---------------- In a message dated 10/7/98 2:32:24 AM, paul@pblay.force9.co.uk writes: < There is more than one Thorold. I am willing to accept the traditional view that he was actually Godiva's father and sheriff of Lincoln as recorded by Faris in _The Plantagenet Ancestry_. After all the electrons 'spilled' here and all the ink 'spilled' elsewhere, this is still befuddled. This is one of the last puzzles I was trying to conclude before actually printing THE ANCESTRY OF ELIZABETH OF YORK. Marlyn Lewis, the compiler, has kept the ancestry along the traditional lines as recorded by Faris and Turton, i.e, Lucy's father is the son of Leofric and Lady Godiva. Even though some modernists believe that the Leofric connection is invalid, I still tend to think that it makes more sense than the alternatives, therefore I am solving the problem by noting that the connection is disputed and printing the traditional information anyway. There are several reasons for so doing: CP: "The link between Lucy and Aelfgar is the manor of Spalding, County Lincoln, which was held by Aelfgar before the Conquest and by Lucy's first husband, Ives Taillebois (in her right), at the time of Domesday. Other manors of Thorold which passed to Lucy are Belchford, Scamblesby, Stenigot, Tetney and Donington. (a) Lucy also held Alkborough, (b) which had belonged in the time of the Confessor to William Malet, (c) father of Lucy's uncle Robert Malet. If Lucy's mother was William Malet's daughter, this may have been her maritagium; and the fact that Thorold gave tithes in this place (d) has been advanced as evidence that he was her husband... the only known children of Aelfgar are Edwin, Morcar and Aeldgitha, wife of Harold, and consequently the passing of the manor of Spalding cannot be held to justify the inference that Aelfgar was father of Lucy. " The Croyland Charter is dismissed because it is a late or forged charter--not quite contemporary--rewritten by the clergy to justify their possession of lands, as is the case with most forged charters. That does not necessarily mean that the genealogical information is absolutely false, but it does mean "stop, look and listen." Nor does that fact that Lucy was not mentioned as Aelfgar's daughter mean that she was absolutely not his daughter. The only daughter mentioned was Agatha (Aeldgitha) who married Harold II--killed at Hastings and she married a very famous figure. This is neither proof nor disproof that Lucy was her sister. Regarding the confusion about the Lancasters, it seems that the monks were confused and had the wrong information. "To this the monkish chroniclers have added the fiction that he was the son of Ketel, son of Eldred, son of Ivo Taillebois (Mon Angl iii 553 & Cockersands Cartulary, Chethem Soc (New Series) xxxix 305), whereas he was almost, if not quite, contemporary with Ivo." Richard Borthwick wrote: "If Lucy had a son by Ivo, presumably he would have been heir to her lands and thence to the Lancaster family. From what I can recall this is not what happened." An answer may be that the son, William, died before his sister Beatrice. Then he would have been capable of inheriting only a very small (4x8) plot of land. Beatrice, married Ribald, the illegitimate son of Eudes. Also, Ivo had at least one--if not more--illegitimate children. William may not have been Lucy's offspring, but still a son of Ivo. Faris has Aelfgar III married to Alvarissa Malet, daughter of William Malet. Though Alfgar died in 1061, before the conquest, this marriage could still be valid. Their daughter, according to this reconstruction, was Lucy. Though this scenario seems to make the most sense to me, it will likely never be proven. Neither will any alternative scenario be proven. For all the revisionist 'ink spilled', and all the trillions of rearranged electrons, no proof is obtainable now or in the future unless the future sees a major archaeological discovery. Therefore, one can let the emotional side have some weight ... and there is an emotional side: Lady Godiva is one of the most famous of all women in the entire span of history. The legend of her ride through the village stark naked on a horse has inspired adolescent boys to late night visions for a thousand years. Each and every one of these boys have become the 'peeping Tom' who could not help but gaze upon that erotic scene. If Lady Godiva is to remain in the historical record as a Plantagenet ancestor, then the scenario of her family connections cannot--and should not be--summarily discarded. To do so is a disservice to her memory and the fantasies of young boys throughout the ages. Kenneth Harper Finton Editor/ Publisher THE PLANTAGENET CONNECTION | Malet, Alvarissa (I70349)
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| 104 | ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- -------------------------------------------------- Following copied from a paper by John S Moore, University of Bristol in "Prosopon, Newsletter of the Unit for Prosopographical Research", Oxford University website: www.linacre.ox.ac.uk/research/posop/Prosopon11.doc ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- -------------------------------------------------- Gilbert de Maminot's barony of West Greenwich (Kent) passed on his death in 1101 to his son Hugh and on Hugh's death before 1131 to Hugh's son Walkeline I, and to the latter's son Walkeline II by 1157. When Walkeline II died childless c. 1190, his heir was his aunt Alice, daughter of Hugh de Maminot. Source indicated: Sanders, "English Baronies", pp. 97-8 and references cited, p. 97, nn. 9-10. The Emma who temporarily controlled the Maminot barony in 1129-30 (P.R. 31Hen. I, p. 67) was presumably Hugh's widow. | Maminot, Walkelin II , Lord Of West Greenwich (I70941)
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| 105 | /Alma/ | Alma (I99485)
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| 106 | /Alvsv | Alvsv (I89902)
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| 107 | /Aslaug/ | Aslaug (I90360)
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| 108 | /Berevik/ | Berevik (I96401)
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| 109 | /Berland/ | Berland (I98764)
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| 110 | /Chapman/ | Chapman (I91025)
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| 111 | /Collins/ | Collins (I86772)
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| 112 | /Dalchow/ | Dalchow (I92812)
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| 113 | /Elgin/ | Elgin (I95094)
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| 114 | /Elvik/ | Elvik (I94053)
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| 115 | /Elvik/ | Elvik (I94054)
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| 116 | /Ersland/ | Ersland (I99347)
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| 117 | /Ester/ | Ester (I94356)
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| 118 | /G | G (I89906)
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| 119 | /Gjellestad/ | Gjellestad (I102535)
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| 120 | /Grace/ | Grace (I91027)
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| 121 | /Harvick/ | Harvick (I93268)
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| 122 | /Hauken/ | Hauken (I95087)
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| 123 | /Indreb | Indreb (I90174)
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| 124 | /Inger/ | Inger (I100470)
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| 125 | /Jones/ | Jones (I95109)
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| 126 | /Kegerreis/ | Kegerreis (I95113)
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| 127 | /Kleven/ | Kleven (I94438)
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| 128 | /Kristensen/ | Kristensen (I95705)
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| 129 | /Langfald/ | Langfald (I96906)
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| 130 | /Mabel/ | Mabel (I97344)
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| 131 | /Margot/ | Margot (I102388)
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| 132 | /Mathiesen/ | Mathiesen (I96905)
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| 133 | /Mellingen/ | Mellingen (I97974)
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| 134 | /Nordahl/ | Nordahl (I95528)
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| 135 | /Olsen/ | Olsen (I96109)
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| 136 | /Queen/ | Queen (I91029)
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| 137 | /Rose/ | Rose (I100466)
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| 138 | /Sandbech/ | Sandbech (I96813)
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| 139 | /Stavland/ | Stavland (I89904)
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| 140 | /Stenersen/ | Stenersen (I92013)
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| 141 | /Storey/ | Storey (I94314)
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| 142 | /Ukjent/ | Ukjent (I90774)
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| 143 | /Ukjent/ | Ukjent (I97278)
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| 144 | 1022 founded Troarn Abbey. Note: Turton has Roger as son of Hugh & Josceline, rather than Roger being married to Josceline. After reading the evidence for CP's ancestry in note (c) below, I can see Turton's point. It seems that Turton's interpretation is just as valid as CP's. Turton goes by the "fact" that Josceline married a Hugh de Montgomery and had a son Roger, while CP goes by the "fact" that Josecline was mother of Roger II. One of the "fact"s is wrong. But I think the dates favor Josceline being a grandmother of Roger II, rather than a mother; so I am going with Turton. --------------- ROGER I DE MONTGOMERY, seigneur of Montgomery and vicomte of the Hiesmois, witnessed in 1031 or 1032 a charter of Robert I, Duke of Normandy, for the abbey of St. Wandrille. Between 1028 and 1035 he restored to the abbey of Jumi | De Montgomery, Roger I (I70530)
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| 145 | 1028-1035 Seigneur of Longueville-sur-Scie. [Ancestral Roots, line 184-1] | De Bolbec, Osbern I (I70598)
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| 146 | 1085-built Wassenburg Castle between Rhine & Meuse. | Wassenburg, Gerard III Von , Count Of Guelders (I70961)
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| 147 | 1096-Crusader | D'aumale, Count Stephen (I70297)
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| 148 | 1349 & 1351 - Ambassador to England Custodian of Edinburgh & Berwick Castles. | Lindsay Of Crawford, Earl David (I70014)
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| 149 | 1st Lord Lindsay of the Byres, so created just prior to Oct 1444; Privy Council of Scotland; a hostage for James I's ransom by the English 1424; Justiciar of Scotland north of the Forth 1457, a Lord of Session March 1457/8. [Burke's Peerage] | Lindsay Of The Byres, Sir John (I70156)
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| 150 | 3rd Son, Sir William Lindsay of the Byres, Haddingtonshire, which granted by Charter 17 Jan 1365/6 on its resignation by his brother, Sir Alexander Crawford of Glenesk; married Chirstina, daughter of Sir William Mure of Abercorn, who brought him that territorial Barony. [Burke's Peerage] | Lindsay Of The Byres, Sir William (I70160)
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